Having spent many years in tech support and also being my family tech support, this post pains me.greatly.
I get to see other people ways of using the computer daily.
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/wrists
That’s brilliantly told.
I am a little proud of the little details
Murder she wrote
I had to watch someone use emacs today.
Lucky!
there is a reason i use i3wm on linux.
You cannot use my computer, it is impossible.
Part of the reason I installed Arch (BTW) is to see the looks of confusion and concern on my family’s faces as I’m computationizing
it’s definitely a benefit. It’s always fun showing people how nicely you can navigate and how cleanly you can configure things.
I could unless your i3 config is atypical
good news for you, i use mostly stock binds for navigation, the defaults are always the best, and a few extraneous ones for launching applications and configuration and such.
Do you game? If so, how is it with tiling?
yeah, play minecraft and factorio mostly, it’s great. Opening a game in bordered with another window is a little goofy sometimes, but you can set that workspace to be stacking/tabbed instead of splitting, and that solves that problem, you can also just make it open in fullscreen if you want though. One of the really nice things is since it’s a WM dealing with any sort of fullscreen operations are going to be pretty substantially simplified.
I have had a few weird input issues but that might be my config, i haven’t gone through it incredibly tediously. I can highly recommend at least trying a WM if you haven’t before, i3wm is quite nice as it’s extremely minimal but mostly configured out of the box, you’ll need ot do some minor config but other than that it’s usable once installed.
Watching somebody scroll to the bottom of a very long list by clicking the arrow button under the scrollbar is my idea of hell.
do those arrows still exist?
Yeah, sometimes. I think Win11 fucks with scroll bars so they might be a line there.
Over the years I’ve become accustomed to a highly customised, privacy centric, keyboard-driven workflow that makes heavy use of tiling and modality.
I’m also “the technical one” in my family and friend group…
So when people sit me down in front of their bloated, ad-powered, AI “enhanced,” stock laptops, and ask me to, essentially spend an hour learning about an obscure Windows problem space, then debugging and implementing the fix, I don’t blame them for not realising the pain they cause me.
About 10 years ago, I told everyone I helped that I either installed Linux or they were on their own. And I was never going to physically hold an iPhone unless it was to free them up to go find a hammer.
there are benefits to being a technically advanced computer user:
- you can learn how to use linux.
- once you know how to use linux, you can stop fixing everyone elses problems for them.
once you know how to use linux, you can stop fixing everyone elses problems for them.
I know you meant being able to claim “I don’t use Windows” but just installing Linux has massively lowered the tech support requests I get from my parents.
yeah, installing and configuring linux for other people seems to be getting more and more popular these days. My dad now runs linux on an older thinkpad, he likes it, doesn’t ask for login or any weird shenanigans, just does spreadsheets pretty much exclusively. Works great.
It’s a shame how annoying most modern operating systems are these days.
Seeing people with respectable typing speed using just their two index fingers. What a waste. They could have been great.
The fingers aren’t the bottleneck, it’s the brain. I type just as fast with two fingers as with ten.
Your words do not hurt me, I’m already used to being a diappointment.
That’d be me! Over 90 wpm with mostly my index fingers. I do use other fingers for some keys (I always hit space with my thumb and backspace with my ring finger), but it’s mostly index fingers.
Same. I imagine, for me at least, it’s due to having deal with unendingly different keyboard models and not being in front of a terminal all day.
I can however type relatively quickly with either my left or right hand and with the keyboard facing me or sideways. It’s a skill that’s really useful when helping someone out with an issue they’re facing. (I prefer being at their side over remote, as I can gauge what they do and don’t understand better)
Even if they were half as fast, it’s so much more satisfying when you use all your fingers.
I remember day I started actually using my right pinky finger to press the semicolon. That’s when I became a real man.
That reminds me of when I learned to touch type 3 years ago, I went from 30wpm hunt and peck to 15wpm touch type
Now I’m at ~80wpm and my small brain coming up with words is the limiting factor hahaHah, sometimes I forget how to spell a word but my fingers still remember it
People that learned on manual typewriters will do this.
I (my parents) had a computer when I was 5 and didn’t learn to type properly until I took a typing class on manual typewriters in middle school because computer games don’t teach you to type and we didn’t have the internet
Ah yes, my dad mastered the 2-finger-search-system
Cue Sean Connery in Finding Forester typing a full page with two index fingers like a boss.
YAYYYY
I’M GONNA USE YOUR COMPUTER TO STEAL YOUR IDENTITY
I had to teach my little brother how to download a exe yesterday. Like just the simple every software or game type of installation:
click download on website -> click windows version on GitHub list -> extract folder -> find exe
Quite honestly im impressed he’s been using a computer for like 4 years without ever encountering a .zip fileAnd don’t get me started with my highschool teachers. One of them got SUPER excited because I showed her how to enable looping on a YouTube video because she kept clicking replay every 3 minutes when the song ended (she plays Spanish music before class starts)
TBF if you’re young, so much software just comes through software managers or super easy installers. Steam + Windows store is probably enough for most people. Maybe? Idk, I have no idea what’s on the Windows store except Minecraft.
WHAT DO YOU MEAN YOU DON’T USE KEYBOARD SHORTCUTS
I want to see a Blender expert using it with no keyboard shortcuts. I think you can’t even use some functionality like panning without a keyboard. Unless you bind it to extra mouse buttons or smth of course.
why are you moving the fucking mouse for this?
my sister’s boyfriend leaves his keyboard,
moves his mouse to the + icon
clicks to make a new tab
moves his mouse to the search bar
clicks the search bar
moves his hand back to the keyboard
then starts typingIt’s so painful to watch. He is making progress though! We made him get a sticky note haha
I had an old friend that would type www.google.com in the Google search bar, click the top link, then search.
omg I thought that was just a meme
I’ll be honest, I forgot there was a + button to make a new tab. Now I wanna get rid of it, that’s space that I could put more tabs.
I forgot where that button is because when I need a tab, I just open a random link on the page that I am on in a new tab and go where I need from there
REAL
I think most people do it that way, hell I use Vim and tiling window managers and I still do it that way most of the time.
The number of people I blow away with Win+X [task manager / device manager / system properties / powershell]…
I’m a ninja. I slide my hand over and thumb/index/key and the required window magically opens.
Even win+X/U/U for shutdown trolling.
BECAUSE I HAVE ADHD AND CAN’T REMEMBER THEM TO SAVE MY LIFE
Keyboard shortcuts are my ADHD special interest. Any time I need to manipulate text I immediately start thinking of the Vim commands that will do what I need.
You don’t use keyboard shortcuts because you have ADHD and can’t remember them
I use keyboard shortcuts because I have ADHD and would never be able to stay focused on anything without them
We are not the same
DUDE IT’S CALLED A STICKY NOTE
But honestly if you’re happy with your current workflow then that’s fair
I had a friend once come over and was trying to do something on my computer, and it wasn’t working. I tell him exactly what to do, and it doesn’t work. I watch him do exactly what needs to be done, and it still doesn’t work.
I take control, doing the exact same thing we tried 3 times already… and it works.
I’m convinced electronics just hate some people and refuse to work for them.
Calling someone to help with something is usually the best way to make it start working miraclously
There’s also the phenomenon where you make a forum post and then immediately solve it after (or even before) you submit it. Although that is more because it forces you to think through the problem systematically.
I completely agree. I work in IT, a lot of times I can see that people have taken the exact actions I would, just with no success, until I do it. I always say that it’s like the boss walking in a room and suddenly everyone stops misbehaving.
“Proximity Fix”
It’s because the computers secretly know we’re 1 level of bullshit away from erasing their memories
I believe the main reason to be patience.
If you give the computer some time to work things out before your next attempt, it has more chance of success.
But by that point, the user already made a ticket.
My previous job included basic it support. It was a tiny office and we didn’t have a dedicated IT guy. Now I work in a big corporate environment and boy do I use the support. Why?
- Admin rights, my account (all accounts) are locked down tight.
- Convincing the computer of working like it should be is not what I’m paid for. I have a never ending task list, troubleshooting my own system is not on it.
- I get to sit and watch and do nothing while someone remotes in.
I’m sorry.
I also think the computer is playing the long con. It tsunts, “It worked this time, but one day ,not tomorrow, not next week, but one day, you’ll have do a fresh install.”
Sort of reminds me of the r/talesfromtech support story of an old lady turning her tower on and off by waving her hand in front of her PC.
She had one of those damn magnet bracelets and it triggered the power button.
The Sysadmin Field is a known phenomenon!
We call it the machine spirits and they are fickle as the fae.
That was my experience working in an IT Helpdesk. I would joke that they computers were scared of me.
Oh good I thought me and my kid were the only ones that happened to.
i am okay with this during the few instances where they do things in a better way than i would have. like utilizing some extremely rare/custom keybinds for certain tasks in IDEs. those experiences are eye opening and humbling.
most of the other times though, yeah it’s pretty rough
This is how I learned about alt+drag and middle click in many common DEs.
This is how I learned about alt+drag and middle click in many common DEs.
Excellent! If you can incorporate them into your workflow, you may find your efficiency mildly enhanced, as I did.
What do those do?
In Windows, nothing. In Linux, if your DE supports it, you can hold down the Alt key and click anywhere to drag it, rather than using the title bar.
For middle click pasting: normally, to copy and paste text, you’d have to use Ctrl+c,Ctrl+v (or equivalent methods). Again, if your setup supports it, instead you can just highlight text, then middle click elsewhere to paste the highlighted text.
Oh I already knew about the alt one. I thought you were talking about IDEs lol. Was very sleep deprived when I read this the first time.
I like the middle click one. I knew you could use it to paste, but not copy.
When I made my comment, I was worried that “DE” would be interpreted as a typo … But not enough to expand it.
I’m pretty savvy but I have learned a few tricks from others. Although some people make me grind my teeth down to nubs
When I’m in the passenger seat, I push on the imaginary brake. When I’m watching someone on a computer, I’m pushing shortcuts on the imaginary keyboard.
When they dont use keyboard shortcuts.
Select text -> Edit menu -> Copy, click elsewhere -> Edit menu -> Paste 🤮
Not knowing Ctrl+shift+esc opens the task manager is one thing, but copy and paste should be taught in school.
My lazy ass sometimes doesn’t feel like moving the left hand so I just use the mouse.
Valid
The best shortcut like that is win+X it opens a quick menu with stuff like Powershell, task manager, device manager, and a bunch of other admin stuff.
You can also right click the window icon to open the menu.
I right click the start menu more than I open it normally.
My fingers have that plus the correct directional keys memorized to put my computer to sleep.
I still haven’t grown out of my ctrl + alt + del habit
Step 1: get a 60% keyboard
Step 2: don’t learn where the “delete” key is
Step 3: change the keycaps so you can’t even look at the keyboard to see where it is
Step 4: ???
Step 5: profit!
I used to know this shortcut, but it was one of the many that I forgot after moving to linux.
Thanks for the refresher! I’ll probably get use of this on my work laptop
Ctrl+shift+esc was so useful back when I learned it. I still see people press ctrl+alt+del and click to open task manager. Or alternatively (but not as bad imo) right clicking on the start button and selecting to open task manager
You don’t even have to do it on the start button, any empty spot in the taskbar works
right clicking on the start button and selecting to open task manager
TIL
Win+X opens the same menu.
I still sometimes hit ctrl/alt/del to open the task manager if I’m not thinking.
Too many years of doing that when I was younger and it only brought up the task manager.
Wut. 😮
Thank you for this.
I was going to say why is that even there, but it reminded me of a very useful macOS tip:
You can access all the menu bar items that don’t have hot keys without leaving the keyboard.
Command+shift+question mark opens the help menu search bar and you can type in ANY menu bar item by name and press enter to do it. It will also show any keyboard shortcuts.
Ctrl+F2 selects the menu bar so you can use arrow keys, but that’s slower.
As an avid vim/terminal user, macOS accessibility shortcuts are friggen amazing.
Now I can’t stop picturing a nightmare scenario of having to watch someone do their copy/paste purely from the keyboard, but using the menus via that trick, rather than using the hotkeys. Thanks for that.
I wouldn’t have to paste via menu if “paste without formatting” didn’t require the fingers of a pianist.
Isn’t there a ctr+shift+v equivalent?
Paste Without Formatting exists on the right-click context menu almost everywhere. I don’t consider context menu usage to be annoying (to observe someone using) at all, personally.
But why use mouse when keyboard works?
Personally I find CTRL+SHIFT+V rather uncomfortable to press, not to mention it requires moving your whole hand down the keyboard, whereas CTRL+V doesn’t. A quick rightclick -> Paste Without Formatting is quick enough to do.
Oh that sounds really nice. I’m personally extremely annoyed that their shortcuts differ wildly from Windows and Linux shortcuts but at least this thing is some consolation.
Ooooh thanks! I’ll use that a lot.
People like this have lost ctrl of their lives.
now imagine being a heavy duty vim user and your coworker ssh’s into a machine, opens up vim, and eventually closes it by writing all their changes and then backgrounding the process, and then rebooting the machine
Closing vim is like landing a plane: anytime you can walk away unscathed it’s a success.
That depends on the person, and what their job is. The company IT guy should be able to do things faster than I can (or else I wouldn’t have called IT in the first place) and shortcuts are part of that. If it’s my retired construction worker of a father, there’s no way he was ever going to know the hundreds of windows keyboard shortcuts that the OS does a terrible job of letting anyone know that they actually exist.
