Libb

My bank offers both an app and a website which is nice, but the app is mandatory for doing any kind of operation involving money (which is not that uncommon when logged-in in your bank accounts ;) even when connecting through their website, as the app is used for some ID-ing process.

Then, there are a few not-mandatory but such-an-effing-pain-to-not-use apps, say to ID oneself with some (public) services.

I use a dumbed down iPhone (like, really: no social, no games, no whatever not even email is configured on it) just so I can access those few apps.

The same reason I care about a working democracy. You can’t have one without the other.

I am going to quote myself here:

Allow me to quote myself too, then:

That’s not the point.

I do not disagree with your remarks (I do not use Telegram), I simply consider it’s not the point or that it should not be.

Obviously, laws should be enforced. What those laws are and how they are used to erode some stuff that were considered fundamental rights not so long ago is the sole issue, once again, im(v)ho ;)

Well, except Telegram isn’t a good tool for privacy.

That’s not the point. The hunting down on tools and their creators (and on our right to privacy) is the issue here. At least, imho.

I appreciate your feedback and understand where you’re coming from. However, I believe

You’re more than welcome to believe whatever you want. That does not make it a fact. And certainly not something I’m interested in or I’m willing to consider worth discussing.

Have a nice day.

Hello Science Community, Thank you for taking the time to review this manuscript. While it includes philosophical elements, it also explores scientific ideas that I hope will spark thoughtful discussion and constructive criticism. I look forward to your feedback. Thank you again!

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1XuhV1MwntVU-Gsb7M69jxhudAwGuh4uEkw1Ri4ZkFt0/edit

You are sharing your personal opinion in that text (and, yep, I read it). That’s not science and it’s not philosophy.

Opinions are fine. I mean, we all have opinions and they can differ widely from person to person. That’s the reason why they’re called personal opinions. But they’re just that, opinions, aka the expression of personal judgments/values and personal preferences.

‘I don’t like bananas’ is a personal preference of mine. ‘I think bannas taste like shit’ is my personal opinion on them. My preference and my opinion say absolutely nothing about bananas and their qualities as a fruit. At best, they state a fact about me. Not about the bananas which, obviously, are perfectly fine fruits whether I like them or not.

Despite the intense dumbing down going on on in our societies, opinions and preferences don’t make a science. And if they can sometimes be considered a starting point to a (or some makeshift) philosophy , they still need a little more work — the important words in the latter definition being ‘system’, ‘analysis’, ‘theory’ and ‘understanding’, not expressing one’s opinions.

This. We have not owned a TV since the very early 00s, when we realized they wanted us to pay in order to watch… ads. More and more of them.

If you’re interested, I’d be open to DMing about privacy and security. I would like to learn more about your situation and your threat model and what measures you’ve taken

Not sure to understand your question, my situation is nothing special. I’m a dude that cares about what I consider a fundamental human right, as essential as is/should be the freedom of expression: privacy. A right I certainly don’t want to see thrown away for a few already very rich people to be able to make even more crazy profit, nor in the name of convenience (including my own) not even for my own ‘security’ or well-being, for that matter.

Is there anything in what I wrote that made you believe my situation was somewhat special?

As for the ‘measures’ I have taken. I try to be careful & lucid when I use any app/services/device and I do as much as I possibly can without using them at all, aka offline and the analog or IRL way, which is not that hard for me as I often work much better using analog tools.

If you have any specific question feel free to PM me, I can’t promise you an answer but at the very least I will let you know I’ve read it and can’t answer it.

Like did we forget about the whole “respect other people’s opinions” thing?

I cant say if we have forgotten it or not, but it sure looks like we don’t want to hear about it very much.

It’s all turned binary (pun intended): you’re with us or you’re against us, either you’re good or you’re evil (and then, you deserve to be eliminated). Which is as saddening as it is is… stupid.

So I am looking for generic communities that focus on mobile privacy that doesn’t have drama or toxicity or “extreme opinions”. Any suggestions?

the excessive and constant noise a limited number of people is making, their rage when it’s not pure hatred against whatever they don’t like or whoever they don’t agree with, is the main reason why, a Linux user worrying about privacy myself, I decided to stop wasting my time online with any such ‘tech’ communities. It has become almost impossible to have an open and calm discussion on any topic without someone jumping in and barking like some crazy dog — because reasons.

No matter what their reasons or motivations are to be angry or hateful, I have zero desire to listen to endless rabid barking. There isn’t much to learn in that, at least when you’re not a dog.

And I have no time for that either: we only have a limited amount of time to live before the game is over and there is no extra life to get, no second chance. I realized that a few years ago and decided I would not waste a second more of my time dealing with those constantly frustrated or hateful people. In tech or elsewhere.

Tech-wise, I have had much more stimulating and enriching discussions in communities that are not tech (or privacy or security or Linux)-related but communities where tech can still be discussed and debated (including by very competent tech people) just always in a broader discussion that don’t focus on tech itself.

Not the OP, but I tried encrypting my files before uploading them to OneDrive. Microsoft did not liked that and was constantly bugging me regarding potential threats.

For the moment, lacking any better solution/knowledge, I put DIY encrypted cloud backups on hold (and went back to using iCloud which as far as I understand is encrypted, and as I’d rather not have MS nor Google constantly sniffing my personal files at all) but I will have a look at Hetzner offering. If it’s doable for a non-geek like myself to configure a Storage Box for automated backups, I may decide to use that instead. Being EU-based makes it a + as far as I’m concerned.

I’ve been using Kagi for a little over a month now and I would not want to go back to before that time. As a matter of fact I switched to their yearly paid-plan less than a week after I started using their free trial version. I was hooked.

Next to an iPad I use as one would expect, I also use a Kindle I disconnected from the Web (and Amazon) many years ago. It doesn’t get updates (no need in order to read ebooks) and I have to manually load ebooks, which is fine by me. The battery is still great. And I know nobody is sniffing my reading habits.

I’ve been reading ebooks since I owned a Palm Pilot (yep, that was quite some time ago) and have always privileged digital over print since then: it’s just more convenient.

But a very surprising thing started happening to me recently: tired of having to fight big tech to get some privacy and to avoid updates with always more useless ‘features’ pilled over my reading experience (I don’t like at all how Apple Books is changing), I started purchasing print editions. Instead of the ebooks, I mean. More and more. To the point that last month and the first two weeks of December I purchased zero ebook, only print.

It’s a a nice experience to be certain that no one is profiling my reading habits (I can still purchase books paying in cash if I want to), or enter my house to remove it from my bookshelves. I like it so much that I’ve also started using my notebook and fountain pen much more for note-taking instead of the iPad. Curious to see where it will lead me, if anywhere ;)

100% agree.

judging by how big corpos operate things most of that sub money probably will end up in the company account, not the creators.

Agreed. Suffice to see the valuation of those corps. It’s not the tooth fairy that gave them all their coins ;)

That said, it is YT that host the gazilion of disk space required to store the videos, it is them who manage the website and all our accounts and payments, it is them who deal with comments and moderation, it is them that finds advertisers for creators, and it is them that provide everything else I’m not even aware of. Do they dot it perfectly? Nope ;) But they do it and they too should be compensated for that. And it certainly not free: disk space cost real money, as people’s salaries, even for Google. COudl they share it more generously? I’m willing to bet yes. But it’s up to the creators, not to me the viewer (I would view them on any other platform they chose).

Wouldn’t you say that using an adblock and supporting creators directly (hot take here since you could want to support 50 people), be a more reasonable and better approach?

Better, I don’t think so: it’s the exact same money that is spend in a way or in another. It woudl also ends up costing me more. Which I probably would not agree with.

Reasonable? Well, it can. It depends your priority. Mine, as a viewer is not to have to spend too much of my free time in managing subs and payments. What I want on YT is to watch stuff and have a good time, not turn that into another job of mine (or then I should get paid, like for any job ;)

To be clear, if I had to micro-manage every single creator I like to watch, I would watch… a lot less of them. A lot. I can only think about two, maybe three.

And that would not be good thing for either the other creators and for Google/YT. As a publicly traded company, Google, needs to be perceived as successful (aka, having a lot of views at every single second) and creators themselves, they need the views in order to, well, become popular. No view, no popularity (no popularity, no sponsors). Note that I did not say they need ‘Premium/paid views’ or ‘ad-supported views’. They need all the views they can get, even the ones behind ad-blockers. Ever wondered why YT doesn’t punish users of ad-blockers by not counting their views as legit views? ;)

Ads are fine,

Not by me. I think they are not. I consider ads (and the constant profiling that comes along) a major threat to our society (very personal opinion, but mine nonetheless).

That’s why I’m happy to pay to skip them (while still using an ad-blocker and multiple browsers, to make sure tracking is really screwed). That’s also why I pay for my search engine (kagi.com: zero ads, zero tracking), that’s why I have not owned a TV set since the very early 00s (when TV ads become so prevalent in my country, France): since there was no way to skip ads on TV, I stopped watching TV (I value my time, and my peace of mind, much more than any series or show… and then I can now watch them ad-free on Netflix or anywhere else if I really want, which is not that often). That’s also why I use iOS and not stock android (less tracking less ads, less Google), that’s why I also use a GNU/Linux Debian laptop and a Mac desktop. And that’s why I will never use a Microsoft product ever again: I stopped using Microsoft the day they decided to introduce ads in their OS, making it obvious to anyone all the tracking that was going on. I refuse that. Ads in the OS, ffs…

but while the company is being obnoxiously intrusive and predatory towards Its customers, it’s hard to just pay to not be inconvenienced.

Sorry, I’m not sure I understand that sentence (I try my best to get better but my English is still so limited). Would you mind explaining it otherwise?

I’ve read it. Since you asked my opinion, here it is ;)

As of now the most basic one is 14usd/month, how much of that money gets to the creators that you Want to support?

(to be precise:) I don’t pay 14/month to support creators. I pay 14/month to be allowed to skip the ads that support those channels while still supporting the creators and YT. That’s what I’m paying for, and that’s what’s advertised in big bold face when you look at the YT Premium sub page:

OK, that plus YT Music but I don’t care much about that forced bundle (I use Apple Music). Not a word on supporting creators… Because we know its ads that are supporting the creators, not the premium subscribers. As a premium, I just pay to skip ads. The difference is essential.

Suppose you are subscribed to 28 channels and the sub money gets distributed evenly, that’s 50 cents a Month to everyone, not much “paying their due” in my opinion.

Creators do chose to sign upon YT knowing it’s ad-revenue that will pay them, not the viewer’s money (unlike say, on LTT Floatplane). As a a viewer, YT gives me the choice to a) watch those ads (knowing a small share will go to the creator) or b) pay a Premium sub to skip them (knowing a small share of my Premium will go to the creator). I chose b).

Is it enough revenue for each creator? It’s not to me to say. Not more than it is the creator’s job to worry if I, as a viewer, earn enough money myself to be able to afford the price of the YT sub ;)

Imho, a much more interesting question to ask would be: how much money to a creator gets from YT ads versus how much does the creator gets from a Premium viewer watching the same video? I’m willing to bet they get more from a premium than from the same viewer watching ads or at the very least that they get the exact same value but, quite obviously, I have no idea at all.

In the end, it’s a simple question of offer and demand. I want to watch X creators. Most are on YT. I can skip YT ads for a fixed amount of money, knowing that if i pay that money all creators will be compensated at least the same as if I watched the ads. Win-win. If it happens those creators consider ad-revenues are not enough, it’s a whole other issue. An issue they should discuss together between creators, and with Google. Not with the viewer or… only if it is to discuss the possibility of leaving YT and see how many viewers would be OK to follow them elsewhere and to pay to support their work.

edit: typos & clarifications.

Agreed, on all points.

For me, the main issue will be to get people who have not considered the big picture to realize that even if it helps reduce a real issue, and it does, the solution may be worse or much more costly than the issue. Even more so in the long run.

Yep… There is a lot of teaching/educating to be done.

Lol what will you say them? Your IP won’t be shared to other websites, but only to Google, switch your browser now! That will be so dumb…

I won’t tell them much. I will suggest they read it and let them know I will gladly answer any question they may have after reading it.

They’re just ignorant of the technical considerations but they still have a fully working brain, and given some lead they should easily understand the topic at hand (a bit like, say, if I discussed the differences in the process of painting watercolor versus oil or gouache while you have yourself never painted a canvas in your live I would not consider you too dumb to understand, or laugh at you, I would instead take some time to explain you what are those essential differences and why they matter. Well, this article will do exactly that in regard to Google, for those persons).

As I wrote in my first comment, this article is a nice and clear summary of the issue (Google privacy-washing) and should help them understand or, if you prefer, realize that this issue may be worth getting more into it. Then, could begin our discussion.

Don’t you agree that understanding there is an issue is a required starting point for anyone to take any decision in order to try to correct said issue?

As for the rest of your well thought-out comment, here is my take: I hope they will change, and not just their browser, but I certainly will not tell them to change or to do anything they don’t want.
I know we live in this strange new world, where hostility and mockery is becoming the norm, but barking orders or Loling at the face of people is not what a discussion is supposed to be. Maybe that is something that’s worth repeating, no matter how dumb it sounds.

Thx for sharing.

This article makes for a real nice and clear summary I will share with people around me that don’t get it or can’t be bothered with too much details.

Let’s hope it will be enough to encourage them to reconsider their choice of browsers and online services.