I didn’t shift it. I introduced nuance. Nothing I said denied the impact of imperialism/economic realities. Show me where I said anything like that. I have written several responses that clearly indicate I know those are major factors. At this point responses like yours just mean you are choosing to deliberately misinterpret what I wrote/put words in my mouth and that you are ignoring anything else I wrote that could possibly clarify the situation.

Feels like I’m back on Reddit with this nonsense.

There are also different immigration rates for different states, some of which are as big as major countries. There are many states in the US driving the national average down because they have such a low percentage.

Edit: added some stats.

It would be much more useful to look at it state-by-state as a few states are doing the heavy lifting. I say this as someone is decidedly pro-immigration. The logistics are no small matter

I live in Louisiana. Our only major experience with immigration was hurricane Katrina and they basically rebuilt our communities. I am eternally grateful.

For the same reason we can’t take 15min without the context of the US’s size, smaller countries having larger percentages also need to be contextualized. The raw number does have some meaning here. It’s also about annual rate of immigration.

once they acclimate

I’m curious what you consider “acclimation” (and I assume you mean assimilate) because that’s a pretty loaded requirement

I am not forcing it with hostility. I made a broader point about treating people like pawns on a board and I got lectured about econ 101. Yeah I got a little snippy with them, sure I could’ve not been that way. But these responses are so absurd, they leave no nuance or middleground and keep telling me I am either saying things I didn’t say or put up a lazy strawman as if it responds to what I said.

Also notice not one person wants to acknowledge that there is this implication people have some obligation to not leave their country as it means they are participating in “brain drain.”

I get what you’re saying, I really do. But the fact is people got all prickly when I tried to introduce nuance. Of course economic factors heavily drive our decisions. I’m not sure where I said anything remotely to the contrary, so I’m getting irritated.

I took basic Econ. My point is decisions are multi-faceted. We are not all slaves of the invisible hand 24/7 as it guides our every single decision.

Your phrasing of your first comment certainly read that way to me. I didn’t misspeak. If I did not understand your meaning/intention that’s a fair claim.

Plenty of people seem to agree with me so the dismissive attitude is not warranted.

People make their own history, but they do not make it as they please.

Never said they or we do

Our material conditions limit our agency.

Totally agree

But I agree with you? I’m not sure what we disagree on?

https://kbin.social/m/worldnews@lemmy.ml/t/1000729/-/comment/6477868

I’m not blaming them I am saying they still often make a decision. They are humans who have some control of their lives. That’s not mutually exclusive with saying they are also pressured externally.

The way they were originally described made it sound like they are just pieces on a board incapable of deciding what they want and acting on it.

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I think you have lost the thread here tbh

I didn’t say people had free agency to go to any country they want. You are presenting a false dichotomy. There are different people with different access to different places with different senses of urgency and for different reasons. Many people make choices on whether or not to immigrate, as well as where to immigrate if they choose to. They have agency, they are not just pawns in this discussion to be shuffled around.

I get what you two are saying, but this kind of removes agency from the people doing the moving.

Also: Should people not be allowed to move to another country if they’re “too useful” or “skilled”?

Russia is wildly xenophobic

Yes actually. It’s what you should have done in the first place.

Like I said, it’s a stretch. But this isn’t some rampant issue or particularly time consuming. They should just ignore the question if they don’t want to answer it. People online just have such a hard time ignoring things.

And before someone else feels clever: Yes you could theoretically levy the same critique at me (though I’d disagree), but I would rather skip that part of the conversation as it is equally unproductive.