• queermunist she/her@lemmy.ml
    link
    fedilink
    arrow-up
    38
    arrow-down
    8
    ·
    edit-2
    2 months ago

    The idea that judges shouldn’t be elected is deeply rooted in the reactionary ideology of an aristocracy that believed the masses shouldn’t be trusted with any decisions that actually matter and should be regarded with suspicion instead of trusted with decisions.

    • Womble@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      13
      arrow-down
      14
      ·
      edit-2
      2 months ago

      Judges shouldnt be elected for the same reasons surgeons shouldnt be elected.

        • Womble@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          9
          arrow-down
          3
          ·
          edit-2
          2 months ago

          Legislators are there to directly reflect the opinions and interests of their constituents, judges are there to have expert knowledge of the law and how it applies to each case uniquely. The first needs some form of democratic mechanism to ensure that they represent people’s current opinions, the later needs a meritocratic mechanism to ensure they are experts in the correct fields.

          If judges were the only element of a court I would agree that it would be problematic to have no democratic input, but in common law systems at least that element is represented by juries who are the most powerful element of a court case as they are unchallengable arbiters of fact and drawn through sortition which is even more democratic than election.

          • queermunist she/her@lemmy.ml
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            9
            arrow-down
            2
            ·
            edit-2
            2 months ago

            This is ideology. There’s no material mechanism to actually ensure judges are experts or have merit. They’re just picked by politicians, who themselves are selected democratically rather than by merit.

            This just cuts out the middlemen. If the selection process is unable to select for merit, then it might as well be democratic.

            • Ross_audio@lemmy.world
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              4
              arrow-down
              2
              ·
              2 months ago

              The UK has an independent Judicial Appointments Commission.

              Which can be overruled by an elected official but generally is directed to pick on merit and allowed to do so.

              Allowing professionals to pick experts and only stepping in when there is a problem is much better to me than direct elections which quickly become partisan and obstructive to professional candidates.

              • queermunist she/her@lemmy.ml
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                7
                arrow-down
                2
                ·
                edit-2
                2 months ago

                All it takes is getting a few panel members with an ideological axe to grind and suddenly the selection process for judges and the JAC panel itself becomes politicized in that particular direction.

                But furthermore, the very framework of law is political. You can’t actually non-politically adjudicate disputes or reviews or appointments or dismissals, there are always political underpinnings and ideological assumptions embedded within the process. The very fact that they currently “particularly welcome applications from ethnic minority candidates and Welsh speakers” is political, and acknowledges that it is political and ideological and not truly objective.

                Law isn’t math.

                • Ross_audio@lemmy.world
                  link
                  fedilink
                  arrow-up
                  1
                  arrow-down
                  1
                  ·
                  edit-2
                  2 months ago

                  An attempt to be representative is not equal to being “political”.

                  It’s actually a strength of the system that minorities get some representation rather than being always voted into zero representatives. And they still have to pass the standards to be considered as experts in the field.

                  No system is perfect, but look at America. Small area elections for judges produce poor corrupt picks. Large area elections produce partisan fights with extremists campaigning against each other.

                  There’s no country which is a good advert for directly electing judges.

                  • queermunist she/her@lemmy.ml
                    link
                    fedilink
                    arrow-up
                    4
                    arrow-down
                    1
                    ·
                    2 months ago

                    The concept of representation is political - and anti-representation would also be political. You can’t escape politics in law.

                    Where there’s power, there’s politics.

                    And the worst parts of the American system are the parts where judges are unelected, so that’s a pretty bad example lol

      • selokichtli@lemmy.ml
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        2
        arrow-down
        1
        ·
        2 months ago

        I’m sure as hell I’d want to choose between surgeons. For example, I’d easily choose the one not trafficking organs.

      • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.ml
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        16
        arrow-down
        2
        ·
        2 months ago

        Always great to see how libs who never stop bleating about authoritarianism, don’t actually believe in democracy themselves.